AL 29AB -19-

 Tape A


J: There it goes, it just caught. You mentioned the upper-classmen.

M: The upper-classmen were sort of wandering along the sidewalks and watching

 it and laughing and jiving and uh making comments the...... the ways kids

 do. It wasn't a great uh...... it was a lot of fun. I think uh.... look

 back at it with a certain amount of nostalgic pleasure. I mean I don't

 have any painful feelings about it.

J: What about the rat court? I got the feeling that those also could be fairly

 painful.

M: I gather that there were a few uh that were rough. You always find that

 in a group of 3,000, 3,500 students you're gonna find a couple guys with

 sadistic tendencies and they're gonna try and beat up on somebody.

J: Did you ever get called in front of the rat court?

M: Uh I guess we had a couple over in the dormitory where I was. Uh nothing
 oa\
 of any ...... Y.Y know usual penalty-type things, wacks with a paddle and

 where you were.....by this time you should be able to recite, ph you ought

 to be able to re.... do the alma mater completely, you were supposed to

 carry matches with you in case somebody wanted a light, and you had the rat

 cap. I don't know. There were things that you should know. Should know

 the names of all the buildings and their locations by this time-it's a

 required process. -YW probably had some utility in that you'd learn the

 names of the buildings and you knew how to sing the alma mater yg know.....

 y know kinda thing.

J: But you don't remember specifically being called up?

M: Huh uh.

J: So do you feel that it was..... f a student had never been called up to the

 rat court that they would almost make up a charge and bring him up there or