P: So when you came back, that was already a fact of life. [There were] just a handful
 of blacks on campus, but they were there.

R: I remember that just about the time I came back, [coach Samuel] Ray [Graves]
 recruited his first black players [Leonard George and Willie B. Jackson], the father
 of the current Willie Jackson.

P: And the first track stars.

R: Yes. That is right.

P: Actually, the first black that came into the athletic program [Johnnie Brown] was in
 the track program, but Ray [Graves] had worked with that. But, were there
 discussions about how this was going to be explained to the folks out in West Florida
 from whom you were trying to get $100,000?

R: Never. Never came up in internal discussions or external discussions. That was not
 an issue at any time that I can remember.

P: Because integration came relatively smoothly, but not because everybody in the state
 was happy with it.

R: No. I agree with that. No, that was a problem for the community college when it
 opened down here in Fort Myers.

P: What was the official title of your operation on campus?

R: Dean for University Relations and Development.

P: And you carried the title of dean? So you had to go to the deans' meetings and all
 of that kind of business.

R: Right. You know, one of the things, Sam, which I always felt good about is that I
 worked very hard to be sure all the various academic departments knew that we
 wanted to help in any way we could. Faculty would drop in to the office and I would
 try my best to let them know we were there to serve. I think we helped the Business
 College when they first began a little program to raise money, when they established
 I think what they called Business Associates, and that sort of thing. I traveled with
 Dean [Donald John] Hart [dean of the College of Business Administration] a few
 times.

P: Now you stay on that job until 1969?

R: I am trying to remember exactly when I moved to Santa Fe [Community College at
 Gainesville]. It was either the very end of 1968 or the very beginning of 1969.

P: Let us talk about the move now. What prompted that?

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