D--So that really became a hurt. Do you think that the criticism,

 the punishment, the thirty day suspension and everything dealt out

 by the state was more severe than warented?

S--No. I think they had a reason to punish the company. I don't know if

 they were severe or not severe. It is also my understanding that the

 cause of the problem, my understanding it was just one of those things

 that somebody goofed. And it wasn't Leonard and Jack. The company did

 things that waranted their punishment.

D--It seems that from some of the things that I've read that Leonard

 became very belligerent.

 S--That he did. He was very outspoken. He told them they were unfair. He

 antagonized the situation. But whether the punishment was sever, I don't

 know. Certainly, the state thought that we needed to be punished. But

 what caused this as I understand was just an honest goof and not a

 deliberate goof. That's my understanding. From what I've heard. I

 heard that it was an honest goof.

 D--How big was the corporation at that time? What are we talking in

 employees?

 S--Oh, I would say several thousand employees at that time. I don't recollect

 the payroll amounts. I know that their sales were in hundreds of

 millions of dollars.

 D--When General Acceptance Corporation bought out Gulf American and it

 wasn't too many years that they were filing for bankruptcy. Did you

 ever have any feeling on that, why they did?

 S--I really feel that they didn't know what they were doing. Even though

 Jack and Leonard had a contract, they were just ignored a week after the

 business was sold. They sold it and whoever was running the company at

 that time felt they could handle the company. And they ran into the

 same problems of money and they couldn't handle the situation. That

 they had access to the money. Not knowing what they were doing, they